I was thinking about this. How do you design your level layouts? Do you draw it out with lots of notes, do you just write down ideas, or do you just store them into memory as you work with JCS?

Another peice of thought for this topic: How do you layout eyecandy for your level? is it also pre-planned or is it random?

I am interested in hearing about what you do, so go in a little bit of detail.

To start: I don't have a definate system, I am mostly working with a mental image when I do work, but I find the layouts that I do draw out wind up going into JCS. I made a mental note on my level set about having "3 ways out of a section to the rest of the level" that seemed to work out quite nicely.

Most of the time I plan my layout on paper, or digitally, I then draw the layout into the level with simple blocks. After that I replace the simple blocks with better looking final blocks with eyecandy.

3 ways:

1. Draw on paper and get it to JCS (ends up mostly phail)
2. Not plan anything and make it in JCS
3. Rip off off other levels (ends up mostly phail)

This is a pretty good thread.

I don't have a method I use all the time though. For some of my levels I just made the layout while I was in JCS, so I didn't use Paint or paper. I have made some layouts in Paint though. Those levels are Apple Land (without the bottom level with the water though) Cold Waves, Heated Pipelines, Space Station: Milaria, Diabolical Darkness and The Light Returns. I've made some layouts on paper before, but none of my good levels were made on paper. A part of Death Castle CTF(my second CTF level) was made on paper. But most of the time I start making the layout while I'm in JCS.

I mostly think of the setting of the level. Then I try to break the level up in parts. I fill in each part and try to make them look as one coherent map.

I just start up JCS with no plan on level layout or tileset. Then I pick a tileset and start thinking about what to put in, events, level dimensions, and all that stuff. I like to do it all at once.

I pick a tileset suitable for my level and the layout just appears out of nowhere when I place the tiles.

The tilesets do help set the layout, but the kicker can be breaking from the loop of building platforms to build a puzzle or the like.

Most of the time I plan my layout on paper, or digitally, I then draw the layout into the level with simple blocks. After that I replace the simple blocks with better looking final blocks with eyecandy.

Wow. That differs from me, where I have to render every tile perfect before I move on.

I used to have a whiteboard I would sketch things out on, but then it got taken over by someone else .

I open up JCS and choose a tileset I like and then I close my eyes and press the mouse button for a couple of hours and then I got myself a level.

Seriously though, I mostly get an idea in my head and start creating the level without anything drawn or anything like that. However, I did draw a layout for one level called Extraterrestrials which is my best level ever, so maybe drawing a layout isn't such a bad idea.

Instinct.


It helps to play something with amazing gameplay to get yourself adjusted for a certain feeling. Try watching a speedrun of one of the first three Sonic games. It's inspiring.

I use various methods depending on the gametype or theme (my favorite word). I have never once tried to draw layouts since it's harder to manage smaller details.

If it's multiplayer, I usually get some random idea pertaining to the look/theme of the level which sort of works like a 'seed', then I'll create it in jcs and hope for the best. If I like how it turns out, then I tweak it to get an idea of how the overall gameplay will reflect the personality of the level, and everything falls in place from there.

If it's Single Player or Battle, I just make everything piece-by-piece in JCS, often trying to give an area good eyecandy before moving on to the next piece of layout. If it's CTF or a complicated single player level (the frozen FSP level, for instance, with the three floors you could go up and down between), I'll sketch the mask outline in PSP7, then more or less transfer that over to JCS, and elaborate from there. Note that my CTF levels are not the highest quality ever.

I make up the level as I work.

Well, it's hard to say how to make a level, since all things have influence, like ammo placement, eyecandy etc, so drawing it is quite impossible for me ;o

Most of the time I have some idea - like 10% of the whole layout - and I construct the rest of the level from there on ;P

On a side note, if I just make stuff that I didn't plan out I usually make the layout before the eye candy and ammo placement. But if I do that I always have to do a lot of stuff(the eye candy) so I think it's better if I do the eye candy while I do the layout. But if I try that I still do the layout first.

tihi apple land^_^


the only time i made a level, the layout wasn't planned by me (minisemi )

When it comes to jj2 level design I always plan the layout as I work by trying out different things and see how they fit. It's mostly a matter of trial and error. I work on small sections of the level which later end up as a whole. Some sections do not turn out as great as others, and I try to improve these when finalizing the level. Adding and fixing eyecandy is almost always the last step I do.

I tend to always pick out the tileset first after picking a general theme and atmosphere, so I know what I can and can't utilize. I then pick possible music choices and then listen to them while designing the level on paper. When I get the general design decent, I build the level in JCS and refine the design there.
Considering I've yet to finish a level (aside from one-off mini-areas I only make to post at the screenshot thread), my method is probably not the best.

I make up the level as I work, which isn't really a good idea. I'll make the layout on paper next time I attempt to make a level. The eyecandy is random - I try my best with the tileset I use.

writing/drawing the layout on paper never works for me.

I make up the level as I work. The exception to that rule is the Foo Races; at least 98% of the time, I draw the race out on paper first so I know what 'challenges' go where. I have to know where to put the exploding staircase, after all. ;p

it never comes out the way you drew it on paper

Well, the reason I start by drawing it is usually so I can plan it out before I make the whole thing, if I don't like the layout of the finished product I'll feel like I wasted alot of time and effort.

Originally Posted by Drmoo

it never comes out the way you drew it on paper

Does.

1. Idea. It could a general look on how the level plays, some sort of story that makes it work the way it is (for example, something has to be done in point A while you come from point B, but it's in some sort of area that needs to be accessed through C and with something from D) or just a gimmick that I come up and want to make it a recognisable part of the level (think Sonic games). It has to be good enough to make me want to make this level, and trust me, that's a lot.
2. I draw the layout on paper. Usually I draw on checked paper, gluing pages together as the level grows bigger. The looks are minimalistic and only consider the platform construction and most important events (springs, triggers, gimmicks). During this phase, I also think of selection for tileset, music and level name.
3. Using the chosen tileset, I redraw the level in JCS. Due to limitations of some tilesets, I sometimes have to do small redesigns or use various tricks.
4. After the structure's all set, I test the level and see if it's passable. Usually I have to do some fixes because I tend to forget how high or far the characters can reach (this also includes spring jumps). Sometimes I also add more secrets, areas or even whole parts of the level are altered because the old ones are boring or can't be fixed elseway.
5. Eyecandy. I always do it before the final phase because it sometimes changes the masking in significant ways, so I have to do more testing to see if everything I want to be reached really is reachable. Also, I make sure that there are some sort of hints that there might be a secret in a chosen place.
6. The final phase is putting the enemies and goodies in most suiting places. Lots of testing here, not only because I need to see if the level is fair and everything works as planned, but also because it's the most fun part to test. =)

Originally Posted by cooba

Does.

Does not.

Originally Posted by Drmoo

Does not.

You said "never", however since there is proof that it does actually in fact happen, your rebuttal is useless.
Also from experience: it does tend to match the drawn design.

Here's an example:

The original 20 Foo Races were drawn out before being made into levels. The rest were not.

Tell me, which ones were good and which ones sucked utterly? ;p

the ones you made

Something I just noticed:
When I make my layouts on paper, or digitally I apply lots of imaginary rules to them, for game play, and to keep them looking interesting. Like not to keep one path going for too long without variation or entry to another path. Also to keep everything rather logically done, even if the level is set in nature there is no reason it has to be done randomish the way nature would really be. if you had enough of these rules you could probably make a layout generator.

I just make a concept then place tiles randomly.